Buy this track on iTunes ADD Add Favourite

Well, that was a quick two weeks. And here I am back to work from vacation on a rainy Vancouver Monday. In my mind I’m still in Hawaii, on a beach, reading trashy mags and pondering another day of the same. But really, really I’m in the studio and I am very glad to be back… okay – I’m good with it. Yeah, that’s it. 

Truly, I am most glad to be back with all of you and get our thinking hats back on together.As you can well imagine I had a lot of time to read these past few weeks, and that included catching up on the New Yorker subscription I thought would be so great but instead made me feel like I was back in university trying to stay on top of the reading list.

But I did it, and one particular article caught my attention. Writer John Seabrook put together a great piece on the science of hit making, specifically for Rihanna. What really jumped out at me was this quote:

“It’s not enough to have one hook anymore,” Jay Brown, the president of Roc Nation. “You’ve got to have a hook in the intro, a hook in the pre-chorus, a hook in the chorus, and a hook in the bridge.” The reason, he explained, is that “people on average give a song seven seconds on the radio before they change the channel, and you got to hook them.”

Wow, only seven seconds! I’ve never really timed myself when it comes to hearing a new song, I’d like to think I give it at least 30 seconds.

And you:

HOW LONG DO YOU LISTEN TO A NEW SONG ON RADIO? 

By the end of the show we be able to come up with a new average for Radio 3 listeners. We’re already above most anyway! 

Photo by picanspoints

Share this post

One hook wonder: How long do you give a song to catch your attention?

Well, that was a quick two weeks. And here I am back to work from vacation on a rainy Vancouver Monda…

Comments

display   Oldest First |  Newest First
COMMENTS ARE NOW CLOSED FOR THIS POST!
sethdallob
#1 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome back! I hope I get to see you on Friday when I visit Vancouver!

Shonica
#2 posted by
Shonica
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome Back Lisa! 

Benoit from Ottawa
#3 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

Not to be picky, Lisa, but he actually goes (in the hook count) 1,2, 3.....and 4!

AlexOfAnders
#4 posted by
AlexOfAnders
on Mar 26, 2012

I don't listen to traditional radio, I listen to Radio 3. My dial only changes if something I know I hate comes on or my sirius is acting up in my car and even then, I know there's no reason to turn it off the Peak because Vancouver doesn't have any other good stations.

alsace lorraine
#5 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

I almost never switch the statio on Radio 3, so when I hear a new song, I'll almost always listen to it for the whole thing.

sethdallob
#6 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

noooooooooooooooooooooo! most overplayed song in rotation!

Lisa Christiansen
#7 posted by
Lisa Christiansen
on Mar 26, 2012

@benoit - You are right! Gosh, that's even harder.

Benoit from Ottawa
#8 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

"Master's Thesis"

Guitar hook at the beginning (carried for a long time)

Good final chorus line rhyme (with the title word)

(twice)

Good bridge; good four step notes at the end ("sources")

Good end drumming; good ending.

 

astorrrmt
#9 posted by
astorrrmt
on Mar 26, 2012

welcome back lisa.i dont post often, i listen to the radio during work hours at my massage therapy office and i wanted to pass on a compliment someone gave you the other day. they really enjoyed the sound of your voice in between sets during their treatment. ive gotta give love to craige and grant.. but you never know what they're going to babble on about. so once again, welcome back. also, i like to listen to a song all the way through. sometimes the best part is in a build up to the outro.

garfielduk
#10 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

Hi Lisa, How was Hawaii?

Lisa Christiansen
#11 posted by
Lisa Christiansen
on Mar 26, 2012

@astorrrmt - Happy to make the massage experience that much lovlier.

zammachus
#12 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Lisa! Welcome back. :D

mhender
#13 posted by
mhender
on Mar 26, 2012

@sethdallob you ain't kiddin...songs like this make me miss the thumbsdown button. 

Christine McAvoy
#14 posted by
Christine McAvoy
on Mar 26, 2012

@zamm

<--- i think i look a bit more mysterious, and less pixelated. 

Lisa Christiansen
#15 posted by
Lisa Christiansen
on Mar 26, 2012

@garfield - Hawaii was pretty great.

marie_curious
#16 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome Back, Lisa! How was your vacation?

I listen until the roughly the mid-point (or 1:30-2:00 minutes) before deciding how I feel about a song. But most of the time I'm  not really listening and some songs I haven't even noticed until I've heard them a dozen times. Most of the time I will be singing along to songs I wasn't really aware I'd heard before; tey just creeped into my subconscious.

It's a little different for professionals whose job it is to pick out "hits." I read a book called "Blink" that dedicated a chapter to record companies listening to demo tapes. Artists will normally put a lot of effort into putting together a demo that sadly will usually only be heard for as long as it takes to hit the 'stop' button.

kirkofdoom
#17 posted by
kirkofdoom
on Mar 26, 2012

well if zammy and c-mac posted, i think i have to.

 

i always give a new song a full shot when i listen. for the most part, it's pretty rare that i'll choose to kill a song half way through the first time i listen... unless it's really fucking bad.

zammachus
#18 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

ON TOPIC

I'll listen to a song for at least 30 seconds to a minute. It has to be something truly awful to drive me off earlier. I think the 7 seconds you reference in the blog post is in reference to channel flippers.

I hate channel flippers. Why listen to the radio at all if you're going to spend more time flipping through the stations than you're going to spend listening to a song?

On top of the fact that spending so much time flipping through channels while you're driving is distracting you from the road, significantly increasing the chance you'll get into a crash.

OFF TOPIC

I've spent a lot of time on hold today. Mohawk College has by far the worst hold system I've ever experienced. Humber and Starbucks were surprisingly enjoyable. Original music choices from Starbucks. It was quite funky. Humber piped in their radio news program. Amazing idea.

CMac

You definitely had better lighting. They set up next to the gift shop at the Lightbox. An apt name as there were 30 ft. south-facing windows letting in the midday sun... I wish their camera was as good as the one they used for yours...

Gotta work with what you got, though.

stevierayk
#19 posted by
stevierayk
on Mar 26, 2012

Hawaii!!- excuse me Mrs. Kennedy!

Not a lot of channel switching when using R3 (internet). Usually, if it does have a good hook, I'll latch on right away. Sometimes, it's a slower burn, could take multiple listens.

marie_curious
#20 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

@Zam: Are you considering going to Mohawk? I went to Mohawk.

krib
#21 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

I give a song the length of the sample on whatever site I'm buying it from. That's usually 30 seconds but once in a while they get extravagant and make it a minute.

not really, though...there's very little that I buy brand new without having heard some of it somewhere else before, like here on R3 or youtube (often posted by a friend on FB)

sethdallob
#22 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

I think the entire concept of a 7 second-hook only applies to pop songs. CBCR3 plays all types of music and doesn't attract the pop crowd, so I'd expect the average to be significantly higher here.

zammachus
#23 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Escher

I'm considering it but they're pretty far down the list.

Not that you can get very far down a list of 5.

nvp
#24 posted by
nvp
on Mar 26, 2012

 

Lana tweeted a link to a hilarious youtube clip with Dave Grohl explaining to Kyle Gass how to write hits.  don't have time to link right now, but search if you haven't seen it.

Christine McAvoy
#25 posted by
Christine McAvoy
on Mar 26, 2012

@Zam you mean you wish their PHOTOGRAPHER was as good as mine.

not camera.

 

"Your camera takes really nice photos"

"Your mouth makes really nice compliments"

 

:)

Christine McAvoy
#26 posted by
Christine McAvoy
on Mar 26, 2012

gotta go make the VIA playlist!

alsace lorraine
#27 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

@nvp. It was posted on CBC music a while ago, and it was pretty good.

marie_curious
#28 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

@Zam: As an alumnus, I'll just say this: Mohawk College would be apropriately placed at the bottom of the list.

nvp
#29 posted by
nvp
on Mar 26, 2012

@alsace, oh right, she probably tweeted a link to the blog entry ..

zammachus
#30 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

CMac

If you could have been there to take the photo that would have been amazing because:

A) I would have photos as nice as yours.

B) It would mean that you would have been there and we could finally meet.

alsace lorraine
#31 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

@nvp. Probably, it was a neat video.

CDNz1
#32 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome back, Lisa!

Unless a song is just horrible, I'll give it a complete listen. Same with a new album. 

Benoit from Ottawa
#33 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

This song (Indie Queens) is "all" in the voicing. Its success or failure, anyway.

Beautiful job done by both.

zammachus
#34 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Hey... Beiber is Canadian. He had a humble, independently-produced start. Why doesn't he get any R3 airtime?

#kidding

#soverykidding

KristaMark
#35 posted by
KristaMark
on Mar 26, 2012

Dan Mangan was SOOO good at CMW last weekend. Third time seeing him, and this was by FAR the best I've seen.  The new album sounds even better LIVE. wow.

Won't get sick of this guy for awhile. 

Benoit from Ottawa
#36 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

CDNz1: I'll actually give an album three listens, but if it needs that much care, often, it isn't the best one for me.

garfielduk
#37 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@zammy #34, Don't even kid about it.  NO!

Benoit from Ottawa
#38 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

34: he's signed.

But CBC takes note of your petition.

zoot aloors
#39 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

There's a medium-rotation tune playing lately that makes me wish that I was in Hawaii the past two weeks. Can you guess the offender?

zammachus
#40 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

BfO

Tragically Hip are signed and they still get played.

#StillKidding

#PleaseDoNOTTakeThisArgumentSeriously

adry_q
#41 posted by
adry_q
on Mar 26, 2012

@KristaMark: I think I did see you at the Indies on Sat!  ...But this was in line in the washroom so it was hard to say Hi; and then I lost you inside.  Next time!

I had a GREAT time at the show though, hope you did too!

krib
#42 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Zam,

don't worry, MJ2K1 has been making that case for a while and nobody listens to him

zammachus
#43 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Krib

Who? I've never heard of them.

krib
#44 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

really? MattyJames?

well, he doesn't get on much anymore because of his job. He likes to sneak on when it gets to be Polaris time

zoot aloors
#45 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Zammy, Blaphemer!

You know there are forces underfoot, looking to make that happen? Stay strong, and speak not his name...

zammachus
#46 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Krib

Ooooh right. Yeah, I do know him. Memory lapse.

Zoot

You don't belieb?

Benoit from Ottawa
#47 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

Zamm, he's got the name wrong, it's actually the Magically Tripp'd.

Or maybe the aging group The Replacement Hips

krib
#48 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

what's a blaphemer? is it like a polymer?

zoot aloors
#49 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

I see rep people!

zoot aloors
#50 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

oops, let me put my teeth back in.... Blasphemer!!! There!

Benoit from Ottawa
#51 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

A blaphemer is, as any fool would know, a person who hems blaps. Blap-hemer, geez!

Benoit from Ottawa
#52 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

I must leave you fine people. No, please, stem those tears...

garfielduk
#53 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@BfO #51 I knew that, of course I knew that, are you saying I didn't know that

KristaMark
#54 posted by
KristaMark
on Mar 26, 2012

@adry_q  Ah too bad we missed each other!!  Yea, what do you say when you're in the washroom. Not the best place for an intro!! ha ha. although dont worry my hands would have been clean ;)

Yes, the Indies was a great time!  Again, Dan Mangan was the highlight for me - of course my love for the Sheepdogs is right up there. I just saw Dan in a whole new light with that performance.....so good! 

 

zoot aloors
#55 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

damn this ridiculous Blap! It keeps losing it's hem!!! Arggg! Where's a good Blaphemer wheen I need one???

zammachus
#56 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Zoot

I think our resident blaphemer is out buying elepants to make himself taller.

marie_curious
#57 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

I blap hems, if that helps.

garfielduk
#58 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@zammy #56, it would take more than elephants to make Grant look taller

krib
#59 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

blap sounds a bit too much like fap

KristaMark
#60 posted by
KristaMark
on Mar 26, 2012

@adry_q  

I'm going to try and make it to the R3 showcase at NXNE this year. You should come to that?! Never been, but look forward to meeting more R3'rs and seeing more good music.  I gotta run....but request to be added to the NXNE facebook group to stay connected.  (find me as Krista Currie)

https://www.facebook.com/groups/147417721974010/

KristaMark
#61 posted by
KristaMark
on Mar 26, 2012

Gotta Run!   

zoot aloors
#62 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

See, marie_, that's the trouble when you really specialize like you did with your education like you did, because I'm in the market for Blap Hemer, they hem Blaps. I'll keep your resume in my files though, yes?

garfielduk
#63 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@Lisa, 7 secsons?

krib
#64 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

"I have to go hem by blap. if ya know what I mean ;-)"

zammachus
#65 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Krib

I don't. Could you spell it out for me?

marie_curious
#66 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot: Look, you don't have to sugar coat it. I made my choice, and I fill a niche market. Could I have my resume back, though? ... copies cost 7 cents a piece...

krib
#67 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

this guy

israel kamakawiwo'ole 

who is the late

israel kamakawiwo'ole

krib
#68 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Zam,

Green Day sang about how to hem your blap, in a song called Longview

 

zoot aloors
#69 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@Lisa, we were all hoping you'd run into R3 Darling Crissi Cochrane while on vacation in Hawaii, no dice, though, eh?

zammachus
#70 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Krib

I refuse to associate with anything green.

Yes, that's right. I'm a colour bigot.

krib
#71 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWvKSPQ9p5Q 

Lisa Christiansen
#72 posted by
Lisa Christiansen
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot - That would have been fun, but no. Where was she?

marie_curious
#73 posted by
marie_curious
on Mar 26, 2012

Most bigots are colour bigots.

CDNz1
#74 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

Benoit nails it [36]

Krib nails it [42]

zoot aloors
#75 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

oh my we make our own fun, don't we? We better cool it when ...Hey Lisa!

zoot aloors
#76 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Lisa, couldn't be sure exactly when and where, but your Tropical vacations overlapped. She's bound to give the blog an update any day now, I'm guessing.

zoot aloors
#77 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Lisa, Lee has a really cute photo of you and him in the photo collection of his profile. Did you see it?

Fast and Bulbous
#78 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome back Lisa!  Glad to hear you read the New Yorker! 

Rihanna’s world of mainstream pop is very different than the indie world.  That’s a very formulaic world almost by definition, while the indie world is more creative almost by definition.  In the indie world I think you either have to be more creative musically, or in the case of singer songwriters you have to have great, creative in some way, lyrics.  John K.’s songs are a perfect example.  They’re good musically, but they’re great because of the lyrics. 

How much time do I give a song?  It depends.  Sometimes you can tell quite quickly that a song is little more than mainstream pop.  About 30 seconds of the Arkells is plenty for me.  Other songs are just not very good no matter what genre they are, while other songs/albums need some time to breathe.  Kaputt and Public Strain took a while for me to get into.  Grimes’ Visions, otoh, I liked almost immediately. 

zoot aloors
#79 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Kaputt and Public Strain Wow, two perfect examples of albums that work slowly upon the listener.

Fast and Bulbous
#80 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

I think they were both far enough outside the the current musical conventions, even the indie world trends, that they took some listening to to really “get”, but when you get them they’re both great albums.    

nodice
#81 posted by
nodice
on Mar 26, 2012

yup, that is Matt. played with them last fall and was very surprised to see him. wish he would get blood meridian going again!

zoot aloors
#82 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Have you ever been totally disappointed with a follow-up album? Were you perhaps being unfair to the new material? Have you put an album away, only to give it another try long after the hub-bub of release day has passed? Who will answer all these questions? Are there even any answers to these questions? We shall see...

sethdallob
#83 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@ 82

Yes. Yes. Yes. I will. Yes.

zammachus
#84 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Zoot

Yes. The Killers' Hot Fuss was excellent. Everything else is generic and tasteless.

Yes. Interpol's Antics. Didn't like on the first listen and didn't listen to it again for a year. Not unhappy with it now.

I have never bought an album on release day.

Yes. Apparently Seth and I.

Banana Hammock.

alsace lorraine
#85 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot. Islands album Return To The Sea is one of my favourites. When the 2nd one came out, I took it out of the library and put it on my computer. I listened once and hated it. None of the songs grabbed me at all. I never listened again and deleted it off my computer. When I said this to Jojo on the blog, he was disgusted and told me to give the 2nd (and 3rd) album another chance. I have listened to them, but I am still not a big fan, though a few songs have grown on me.

Fast and Bulbous
#87 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@83

ditto

sethdallob
#88 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@87 keepin' it simple, eh? :)

sethdallob
#89 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

I'm going to see Kathleen Edwards and Hannah Georgas tomorrow night! Can't wait!

TheRadioHead
#90 posted by
TheRadioHead
on Mar 26, 2012

@Fast and Bulbous

I have had several people tell me that you and I are kindred spirits in many musical ideas and tastes, particularly about retro rock and electronic.  I am glad to have an allie, I am weary of being the lone voice for so long...

 

Glad to have you back, Lisa.

 

Fast and Bulbous
#91 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@TheRadioHead

I’m sure there are more of us listening, but the blog is kind of dominated by one group.  Between the two of us on the blog, however, maybe we can encourage the grampa rock fans to move on over to the classic rock channel?  ;) 

zoot aloors
#92 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Thanks all for your responses, you're all very lovable people.

I'm wracking my brain of a good example of my own, but I just flood back to the eighties, and no one wants to hear those old chestnuts again.

zoot aloors
#93 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ F&B, never! I'm a-squatin' right here! Come any closer, and I'll whack you with my walker!

zammachus
#94 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

FnB

Are you making fun of my Grampa?

Vice Admiral Rock fought in the big one, I'll have you know!

zammachus
#95 posted by
zammachus
on Mar 26, 2012

Disclaimer: I don't have any relations named Rock.

OSUChE
#96 posted by
OSUChE
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Lisa: Wow! That was a great tune (morning star) I'd never heard before from a band I'd never heard before! Thanks for that one!

And Hey, Since I'm here on the blog; did you try any Kava while sunning in the Islands?

Okay, back to work for me!

Fast and Bulbous
#97 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@zam

Sergeant Rock, perhaps?

http://youtu.be/OjQwLBYHcx0

UATB
#98 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Re Hook.....

With a lot of Pop, you have to wait for the "chorus"......

Here's one that sinks it deep very fast.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3fX2_bxEkg

à bientôt

 

sethdallob
#99 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

Here's NPR's Planet Money on the song factory android known as Rihanna with the economic side of the story.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/07/05/137530847/how-much-does-it-cost-to-make-a-hit-song

They also did a couple of podcasts related to the article, one in spring, and one in winter (after the song flopped) for a post-mortem.

alsace lorraine
#100 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

@seth. I read that some time ago. It was really interesting to read.

sethdallob
#101 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

Are you a fellow armchair economist nerd? :)

Lisa Christiansen
#102 posted by
Lisa Christiansen
on Mar 26, 2012

@seth - is that a thing?

alsace lorraine
#103 posted by
alsace lorraine
on Mar 26, 2012

@seth, mostly just interested in the music industry. The article was mentioned on the blog. It is interesting to see how the truly manufactured side of the industry works (also, shouldn't it be cheaper to make another shitty pop song?)

Fast and Bulbous
#104 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@92

This is years ago, before I was became total music geek, but I didn’t listen to a lot electronic music in the early 90s.  The Orb, Orbital, Underworld, I knew people who were into it, but I didn’t really give it a chance, and I haven’t caught up on a lot of it yet, like Underworld for example.  And even today maybe I haven’t given a lot of rap enough of a chance.  I also don’t think I fully appreciate the steel guitar as an instrument, probably because of its association with bad country music.    

zoot aloors
#105 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@UATB, yesss! Hot Chocolate gets right to it eh? An excellent band, and beverage.

krib
#106 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast & TheRadioHead

get off your high horses, already. The blog isn't "dominated" by anyone.

krib
#107 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

zoot @92,

why not?

mcfflyer
#108 posted by
mcfflyer
on Mar 26, 2012

Welcome back, Lisa.

Curious: you come to the States (or at least one of them), and I came to Canada. 

sethdallob
#109 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@Lisa 102 - I'm not a global macroeconimist, but I play one on this blog. ;)

Yeah, I geek out on a lot of economics stuff and would like to think I could hold a conversation about fiscal policy...the girls just swoon all over me for it.

krib
#110 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

It's not a science; it's a religion :-)

TheRadioHead
#111 posted by
TheRadioHead
on Mar 26, 2012

@F and B  I am more of the mind to want to convince grandpa rock listeners to see the error of their ways :)

 

garfielduk
#112 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@Lee #108

Is this some kind of "student exchange programme"? and if yes where do I sign up?

sethdallob
#113 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

Re: economics - it is a science, but subject to the same errors as any other science and the people furthest out on the fringe grab the popular spotlight. Data interpretation is faulty...people get the same facts and then our biases kick in. Some ignore data that contradicts their world view (confirmation bias), some misintpret data by omission or comission, and some spend time making the case for everything so they are always right.

However, the fundamental study of concepts like the market setting prices, supply and demand, etc. are sound and well demonstrated. Human behavior, in the macro sense, is fairly predictable.

Let's just say I wouldn't buy a house in Vancouver now, and if I owned one, I'd sell it and rent. :)

Fast and Bulbous
#114 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@92 and @82

I guess I didn’t really answer the question.  You were asking about a band we like the first album from, but didn’t like the follow up album.  Yes, but I’ll have to think about an example. 

Fast and Bulbous
#115 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@TRH 111

Naw, people can listen to what they like, but if you like classic rock and old time music, then why are you hanging out on the new music blog all day long? 

sethdallob
#116 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@114 I can think of one, but I think I'll get lambbasted for it. I really liked Dan Mangan's Roboteering EP, but thought the follow-up was pretty meh. Certainly not worthy of 'the second coming' treatment it got here, IMHO. A couple of songs slowly grew on me, but I still reiterate my 'meh' rating overall.

Go ahead, throw your virtual tomatoes at me.

zoot aloors
#117 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ krib, OK, I'll kick in what I can, It's a sad story though, about a kid that ate, drank and thought all things Rush. My hometown must have been RushFan Ground-Zero, because the whole school must have camped out for the highly anticipated follow-up to the blockbusting Moving Pictures LP.

I feverishly place the needle upon the edge of Signals, champing at the bit for the next Tom Sawyer, and when the futuristic synth sounds of Subdivisions beeped through the speaker, well, let's just say I was non-plussed that my favourite band messing with a winning formula. Geddy had replaced his Eunuch-like warble with a more mature, new-wave bleating that was less rock and more Eye-Roll for this dejected little guy. Alex's familiar guitar attack had been replaced with some Reggae white-boy wannabe! But Neil? Oh Neil!!! Most distressing of all was the Professor himself, rigidly keeping the beat like a freaking egg timer. "Where are the flourishes??" I wept aloud, to no-one. "Where are the flourishes???" I replaced the record into its sleeve, bitter at the wasted potential and expense.

Next year, puberty hit, thank goodness, and I eventually learned to deal. Grew to absolutely love Signals, too, eventually.

krib
#118 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast,

you're making quite a few assumptions. It's entirely possible that people hang out here because they like music, and aren't that worried that a lot of the "new music" trends are re-hashing old themes.

Also, a lot of people just like hanging out on the blog to chat with others. I have great chunks of time where I turn the sound off because I'm doing something else, but the blog is often still ticking by on the screen

TheRadioHead
#119 posted by
TheRadioHead
on Mar 26, 2012

@F and B  I do think this mysterious period of nostalgia and mimicing old music is a passing phase.  I am convinced I can argue people out of it faster.  

 

Great to connect with you, I have to leave now though!

Fast and Bulbous
#120 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@seth

I think that’s pretty common.  I think one problem is that we build up expectation of what we think it will sound like, and the artist may have gone in a different direction.  I find that if have no expectations for a follow up album I like it better. 

CDNz1
#121 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

The only thing this blog is dominated by is the overwhelming sense of community. We all have our tastes, our differences and have given up on conventional radio. Where else can you find a half-naked Canadian living in the States who likes D-Sisive, Born Gold, Besnard Lakes, Tasseomancy and Wax Mannequin willing to hang out at shows with Joel Plaskett lovers and haters?

zoot aloors
#122 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

I never throw away a song because of its age, and that seems to be the major flaw in your opinion, Fast. Have you never been shocked by the forefathers of a genre ie: a guy like James Brown, who really flipped music on its ear when he was at his peak? Or feel a twinge of nostalgia when some new song samples something from your ancient past?

Benoit from Ottawa
#123 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

116, sethdallob, I thought roughly the same thing after hearing a rebroadcast on R2 of the live unveiling performance of that album.

Also, I'm having trouble getting into Said the Whale's latest album, Little Mountain; whereas Hey Ocean!'s IS just flies; it's similar to their two previous efforts, but struck me as even better.

flagpole music
#124 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

ok, Lisa  - welcome back for reals & not just from my phone while i'm on the bus!!!

flagpole music
#125 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

ok. who know how to make my image chose square instead of landscape?

sethdallob
#126 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@116 I think I'll be crucified if I badmouthed Dan Mangan *and* Said the Whale on the same blog. I really like Said the Whale, but have seen 2 live shows now and been underwhelmed. While I'm being blasphemous, I'll say I think the Pack AD blew the doors off and totally stole the show from other fan favorite, Elliott Brood.

flagpole music
#127 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

#121 "Like"

zoot aloors
#128 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

#127 "Like"

krib
#129 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Seth,

no. nobody is going to get that upset. A few zealots may try to convince you that you should give them another chance or something, but that's about it.

I've stated on the blog how Arcade Fire does absolutely nothing for me, and I'm still here :-)

zoot aloors
#130 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

flagpole, you cannot switch em up, I'm afraid, the square photo is just for your tiny avatar photo in the Fans lists.

sethdallob
#131 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@ flagpole....did you move to San Diego? I was putting my pin on the radio 3 listener map and your dot was way, way south of LA...

Fast and Bulbous
#132 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@krib 118

I don’t think it’s an issue for the bloggers so much as it’s an issue for R3, but if they’re trying to create different music communities, and there is a group of people who are more into reto music who are hanging out on the new music blog just because it’s convenient, then I think that’s a problem.  A few weeks ago Grant had a blog where he asked what festivals people were going to, and many people said NXNE, a couple said Sled Island, and I don’t think anyone said Pop Montreal or anywhere else.  What that told me is not that Sled Island and Pop Montreal will be empty this year, but instead that pretty much the only people who post here anymore belong to one group of friends who all happen to be going to NXNE.  I don’t think it’s the fault of the bloggers, I should add, but I think this blog has become a hangout spot for a couple of dozen friends who are using it as a place to just hang out, and everyone else has gotten tired of it and left. 

CDNz1
#133 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

@Seth - That's the cool thing about the R3 blog, your opinion is valued. I'm not a huge Stars or BSS fan and that's my taste. Mine. MINE. MINE. 

flagpole music
#134 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

tks, zoot. it does rather ruin the effect in this case:)

@seth. nope. 

 

Old Abe
#135 posted by
Old Abe
on Mar 26, 2012

This is a test:

http://static.music.cbc.ca/v2/userprofiles/38/38025/images/great-lakes.jpg

 

Old Abe
#136 posted by
Old Abe
on Mar 26, 2012

Nope doesn't work...I like your pic Flagpole

krib
#137 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

CDNz1,

you don't like Stars?

Infidel!

sethdallob
#138 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@133 & 137

Yeah, what the hell? Get out of here! ;)

CDNz1
#139 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

*I've secretly replaced Stars with Kellarissa, Allie Hughes and The Ruby Spirit.

Fast and Bulbous
#140 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ zoot #122

Not following your post.  I don’t recall saying anything about throwing away a song.  You do acknowledge that there are different genres of music, yes?  Almost all radio stations, and CBC Music as well, organize themselves around certain genres, and new music and classic rock and blues are different genres, wouldn't you agree? 

 

 

 

garfielduk
#141 posted by
garfielduk
on Mar 26, 2012

@flagpole, this version my work better for you http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4362079/great-lakes.png

flagpole music
#142 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

tks @Old Abe!!  you can get t-shirts at www.downwithdetroit.com

i follow them on the facebook & they're pretty awesome to keep up with my old home state while I'm out here in Cali.  tho, I think they need to hook up with N2DS2W to do their music coverage because it's non-existent.

cathyort
#143 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot, just got back from the barn, what a nice comment at the end of Grant's show. We have so much fun with everything and everyone R3. It is so very nice to have you on the blog again!

And going way back to Craig's show and my educational meld picks: yes, I was the chocolate cake with zucchini hidden in it mom. They were never the wiser.

flagpole music
#144 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

YORT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

flagpole music
#145 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

#143 - i'm still brownies with applesauce hidden in them. & I don't care if any one knows.  actually had a really lovely baking conversation with Mark Sasso about that.

cathyort
#146 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@flagpole music, re. your blog pic, is that a new Pure Michigan ad?

flagpole music
#147 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

#146.  i wish.  i need a video of Mayor Bing saying that.  & loads of other famous Michiganders.  I'll take my camera for coffee in case I run into Dax Shephard again.

zoot aloors
#148 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Fast, If I mistook 'Grampa Rock' with 'oldies', I apologize.

The reason the R3 is always populated with commenters is because of the access to hosts and fellow bloggers. The genre tabs which are pretty well brand new, and are not hosted on a daily basis, so there is less of an attraction, as it stands, but if there were a number of dedicated bloggers anywhere in CBC Music, I'd be attracted to them too.

sethdallob
#149 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

Yay! I'm going to see Teen Daze for the first time Thursday night in Vancouver! Chair dancing mode on!

krib
#150 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast,

it may well be that there is a core group here; that's true of many communities (not just online communities, either). the NXNE meet-up was pretty big. I (and many others) weren't there, and I think there were more than 40 people there. A lot of people drift away because their jobs and life don't let them. Some people will leave for other reasons, like they have jumped to the conclusion that it's a "clique"

that happens everywhere. You did say above that the blog is dominated by one group. It's a helluva big "dominating" group, given that the NXNE meet-up had people from both coasts and many points in between.

If all goes well, I'll be on a trip to Vancouver soon, and I'll be able to contact people - only two of whom I've actually met in person - and go hang out because of the blog. I think that's pretty cool, myself

 

zoot aloors
#151 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Cathy, Aw shucks, missy, 'tweren't nothin'.

UATB
#152 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

@Fast and Bulbous #132 ... last line.... I agree with you. I have noticed that with certain #3 blogs, the question gets lost in a runaway social convention. Not that that's bad, but why not just have a "how are you?" blog every day?...or a what's bugging you? blog.

à bientôt 

zoot aloors
#153 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Dax("Go, away! 'Batin'!")Shephard? There can only be one!

UATB
#154 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

....mind you, I have run away with zoot here and there......

zoot aloors
#155 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@UaTB, yep! we've been having a blast this last week finding each other's posts in the genre tabs!

I wish one of the link boxes on the main page hyperlinked to the Last Updated Post, so you could easily spot the action elsewhere on CBC Music.

cathyort
#156 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@flagpole, speaking of Pure Michigan:

a new study by Longwoods International shows that last summer’s Pure Michigan advertising campaign brought record numbers of out-of-state visitors to Michigan in 2011.  Summer advertising motivated 3.2 million trips to Michigan last year, and those visitors spent one billion dollars at Michigan businesses, paying $70 million in Michigan taxes. Comparing that $70 million with the $14.2 million spent on Pure Michigan summer out-of-state advertising last year, the state received $4.90 back for each dollar invested in Pure Michigan advertising in 2011. 

CDNz1
#157 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Fast - NXNE has the appeal for many because it will bring together so many bloggers from within four hours of Toronto AND the natives have offered up their porches, yards and floor space. If I knew any bloggies in MTL, I'd give PopM a try. Sled Island would be a chore for some of us Easties. Someday, perhaps... 

cathyort
#158 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@CDNz1, I did say I'd like to go to Pop Montreal...

flagpole music
#159 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

hey, @Lisa - an off-topic but hilarious welcome back for you.  link below.  geez, I love Matt Walsh. this makes me happy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/26/downton-arbys-parody-of-pbs-hit-fast-food_n_1380744.html 

 

 

**it will probalby set the boys off.

krib
#160 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

I'm getting tired of that iron throne thing on Grant's show. Eventually, it's 15 minutes will be up

flagpole music
#161 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

#156 - that is awesome.  i have to get a visit organized.  I guess I qualify as 'out-of-state' tourist.

flagpole music
#162 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

"Ropes That Way" was stuck in my head all weekend so yeah, I'd call it 'hooky'. for me:)  I like more & more all the time.

cathyort
#163 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@krib, ha I just had to Russ what the heck "iron throne" meant...

CDNz1
#164 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

*News Flash*

Rococode are incredibly good live, even with 75% of them sick. And just lovely, too.

They're heading west. Do. NOT. Miss.

 

cathyort
#165 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@Lisa, re. your blog question: I think hooks are really important in songs, but I'm not so easily distracted that I need more than one!

What really gives me the creeps is the phrase "the science of hitmaking." Which I think largely explains the state of commercial radio.

sethdallob
#166 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@164 looks like they need to turn south instead of running east-west across Canada...

flagpole music
#167 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

I think it's adorable how Russ is sporting that yellowish gold R3 symbol in his pic to match Yort's poutine.  it's all gold & stuff

UATB
#168 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot Re#155... among other stuff, I crapped all over Lionel Richie and Carrie Underwood today, talked about my model train set with Neil Young and linked up to Daniel Lanois playing guitar with Willie Nelson and Emmylou... but I'm friggin alone over there......

UATB
#169 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

boo hoo

cathyort
#170 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@flagpole, it's all FOOD and stuff.

CDNz1
#171 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

<----- Cheesy.   Real Cheesy.

Benoit from Ottawa
#172 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

cathyort, "the science of hitmaking" is bull pies.

I have heard interviewed people who have had many hits, and who stated that categorically if perhaps not as colourfully. Followed by: if there was, there'd be a lot more hits.

Benoit from Ottawa
#173 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

Better grammar: if there were, there'd be...

Fast and Bulbous
#174 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ zoot #148 and others

It’s great that people are enjoying this place, and that they’ve made friends, and that they’re jumping into bed with each other four to a bed ;), but this is the point where the gang should really take it out back.  R3 is like a big open discussion hall.  In this hall a group of people met and became friends, which is a good thing.  But then the group started talking louder and louder, and then they started to just hang out and talk to each other in the trivial ways that all groups of friends do, and it started to become disruptive for everyone else, and eventually everyone else just got sick of it they left, and now the hall is basically empty except for this one group of friends. 

The point is that there are interests that need to be balanced.  It’s great that this group of people became friends, but now they should “take it out back” and not disturb everyone else.  More specifically, in order to make this a more open place again, I think R3 should limit the number of posts a person can make to maybe 7 or 8 per show.  This is still a lot, and it allows for some back and forth, but  I think limiting the number of posts to about this number would help to keep people on topic and contributing to an open discussion, and if people wanted to joke around with their friends they could take that somewhere else.  I think doing this would open this place up again and make it a lot more welcoming, and bring in new people and new music fans to the blog. 

flagpole music
#175 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

aww....I just got a Moniski postcard all the way from Belfast. That & having Lisa back?  what a happy Monday!

Benoit from Ottawa
#176 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast, I don't think anyone's about to police this blog.

flagpole music
#177 posted by
flagpole music
on Mar 26, 2012

@Yort & @CDnZ1 - woot for colour coordinated food!

sethdallob
#178 posted by
sethdallob
on Mar 26, 2012

@174 I think each show has it's own personality. Grant's show is turning into the booze-it-up free-for-all social hour...that's why I hang out more with Lisa's show, where the pace isn't as frantic.

I agree with your sentiments, but these things have a way of working themselves out.

UATB
#179 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast... I think it's about sticking to the question, somehow...

124th Street Beat
#180 posted by
124th Street Beat
on Mar 26, 2012

@174

Nice post F&B- I agree with you 100% in the first paragraph. You feel a little lost when you aren't part of the crew, and as an impartial viewer (as I kind of see myself since I like to comment and comment regularly, but don't really expect responses since I am not part of the crew, but aren't really fussed about it), you really can see how a lot of the new people don't hang around after their first forays onto the blog.

However no regulations please, hopefully people themselves will realize this and maybe reach out a bit more to the occasional blogger, or new blogger and try to involve them in the conversation. I won't hold my breath though, this has come up on the blog before and those who have brought it up before tend to get termed haters and such.

Benoit from Ottawa
#181 posted by
Benoit from Ottawa
on Mar 26, 2012

F & B, I think you have a few misassumptions in, for instance, the second paragraph of 174

It’s great that this group of people became friends, but now they should “take it out back” and not disturb everyone else.

Me: What's with "disturbing"? Do others on the blog have a right not to be "disturbed" (I don't even know what that means).

... I think limiting the number of posts to about this number would help to keep people on topic...

Me: That's not a criterion here, keeping "on topic".

... and if people wanted to joke around with their friends they could take that somewhere else.

Me: Again, why?

I think doing this would open this place up again and make it a lot more welcoming, and bring in new people and new music fans to the blog.

Me: Current activity doesn't really close a thing, as new people come on all the time, often after lurking for a bit. I'm not sure that joshing around is not "welcoming", although I appreciate the "clique" argument, the "in-jokes" exclusivety.

But I think you're starting off from some principles that don'Mt actually much apply here.

All that said not nastily...



Fast and Bulbous
#182 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ seth & UATB

I often don’t even read the two morning blogs.  It’s pretty much the same thing every day.  It’s just a group of friends, hanging out, and saying basically the same things, every day.  I think the way to keep people on topic, and move a lot of the hangout stuff off the blog, would be to limit the number of posts.  Even if they went to 10 per show I think it would make a big difference. 

zoot aloors
#183 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Fast & Furious, It's amazing that we can get along at all! This country is so big and regionally biased, you're correct that some areas are under-represented. But that isn't because of who IS contributing. It's a problem, despite everyone's efforts to include (Quebeckers for instance) the folks we wantt o kick in, you can't6 lead a horse to water, and time will tell how popular this place really ought to be.

Either way, Fast, I dig talking, and even debating stuff with you, and hope to feel free in doing so whenever the mood suits, I hope you feel the same.  

UATB
#184 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

...you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him think....

Fast and Bulbous
#185 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ BfO #181

See paragraph #1 of 174.  It's the basis for my suggestions in paragraph #2. 

UATB
#186 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

....@ Fast.... If the host played "chairman" and tryed to keep things in line?????

Fast and Bulbous
#187 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ zoot #183

Again, not really following.  I don’t recall saying anything at all about areas of the country being underrepresented.  That could be a separate discussion, I suppose, if you wish, but it’s not anything I’ve referred to here. 

zoot aloors
#188 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ fast, you made mention of Pop Montreal being a fringe event in the R3 universe, and the demographics that drives the conversation. I thought that we were in agreement about the lack of accross the country representation here.

UATB
#189 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

silence is golden?

Fast and Bulbous
#190 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@UATB

I’m not sure I’d want to put that on the host.  I think just limiting people to X number of posts per show would go a long way to solving the problem.  One solution might be to set up another blog here for people to just hang out in.  That would be more work for the moderators, but perhaps a some of the regular could be given limited powers, perhaps the power to hide posts and contact a moderator if someone was posting anything inappropriate, and that would make the extra work for the R3 people minimal. 

krib
#191 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

yort re:163

lucky Russ. At some point it will fade away

UATB
#192 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Yes I agree... Today's coffee house, or lunch bar, or whatever.

zoot aloors
#193 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

If I can suggest anything, I'd suggest enjoying the CBC Music genre articles, contributing a few comments in there, and hope somebody stumbles on your comment. It's pretty cool when those posts begin to fill up.

UATB
#194 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Come on down!

UATB
#195 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

So long, zoot.... nice meeting you, Fast.

Fast and Bulbous
#196 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

No, zoot.  I said nothing about Pop Montreal being a fringe event in the R3 universe, or that demographics drive the conversation.  I said that none of the blog posters here said they were going to Pop Montreal, which tells you that the people who post here represent only one very small group of indie music fans in Canada.  If by R3 universe you mean the indie music community in Canada, then Pop Montreal is a very big part of it, likely bigger than NXNE.  And the issue with that one group of people is not their demographics per se.  It’s that they’re dominating the blog, and over posting, and just hanging out on the blog to the point where they have become obstacle to other people joining the blog. 

Fast and Bulbous
#197 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

Nice meeting you too UATB!

krib
#198 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

No it won't. It will kill the blog.

you may not like how the other shows have evolved, but the people who go there do and new people do join the blog. Whether they hang around or not is much more complex than you're making it sound

krib
#199 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

and, what about the lurker who loves Zeus, who is just deciding that he (or she) might post, only to read you or theRadioHead going on about how boring and non-innovative it is? Think they're going to leap in then?

krib
#200 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Before the new site came up, we (this insular community) were asked about improvements we'd make to the site and the blog. One of the most prevalent suggestions was to have conversations threaded, so when a tangent happened, it could be largely contained to a single post and responses, and those who didn't want to read it could shrink the post and ignore it. That didn't happen. I don't know why not, but it didn't.

The people here are well aware of how loose the blog is. Most of those who are here are here for that very reason. That is how communities form.

zoot aloors
#201 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Apologies to 124th Street Beat if I've ever failed to acknowledge your posts. It's true that the most popular blogs zip by so quickly, that many salient points go unnoticed, and I certainly would never do that puposefully. I see you as a regular, good guy on the blog, and I read your stuff whwneever i notice it!

cathyort
#202 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot: I just said that very thing about you to Russ when I sat down and first posted in this blog.

cathyort
#203 posted by
cathyort
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot: p.s. that I knew you had @ed me I didn't reply...

krib
#204 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

I don't believe anybody gets termed a "hater"

It's a difficult thing to do, to develop as a community and be open to all newcomers. The community develops its own character, and when new people come along they identify with it or they don't.

how do you involve somebody new in a conversation, especially when you don't even know if they're out there because you can't see who is logged in (and, when we've discussed this in the past, lots of people leave themselves logged in all the tim)?

Fast and Bulbous
#205 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@krib

And, of course, this kind of “community” drives everyone else away (see #174).  Do you really think this blog should be just for a few dozen friends to hang out on all day long every day?  Or should it be a welcoming place for all indie music fans in Canada?

zoot aloors
#206 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ Fast & Furious, I have no silver bullet to solve the issue, and I can only imagine how crazy it all is when you add in all the Twitter feeds, Facebook FunPages, and Tumblr accounts oozing from this place. It's too much for me too, man.

@ Cathy, see? that's the funny thing, I'd never want you to worry about responding to my posts, but other folks would kill for some loving! It's a tightrope walk, to get everyone's preferences down!

CDNz1
#207 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

@124th - You have caught the eyes of hosts and a few of us and we have all responded. Sometimes we get busy at work (goshdarndamn work) and cannot comment. It's a normal occurrence and happens to everybody. If I've never said it before, I'll say it now: Welcome! Nice to have you here.

krib
#208 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast,

no, not in the least. I'm saying that's just what happens with communities. I'm curious to know how deriding anyone who listens to music like Zeus helps build that community

CDNz1
#209 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

When has this NOT been a welcoming place for all indie music fans in Canada and beyond? That's what this is and why I'm here!

Fast and Bulbous
#210 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

The problem is fairly simply solved.  This has become a place for a small group of people to hang out, instead of an open discussion forum a large sampling of Canadians.  In other discussion groups the mike gets passed around and different people get a chance to speak.  In this forum you can speak when you want, but like the other kind of forum you shouldn’t be able to speak as much as you want.  Wouldn’t you agree zoot and krib? 

Fast and Bulbous
#211 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ krib

I’m curious about why you’re so concerned about Zeus, but you say nothing about people bad mouthing Grimes, on a new music blog no less.  The problems with Zeus being on a new music blog are obvious, and have already been discussed, with you. 

Old Abe
#212 posted by
Old Abe
on Mar 26, 2012

Lurking

zoot aloors
#213 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

I know that I've never found a place like CBC Music before on the internet, and the people here are of a kind, my kind, for better or worse. The goodness far outweighs the bad, and if you have the desire to contribute, or lurk, I won't fault you. I can't defend the numbers of comments that I make, because I never thought to measure myself, if that is what you're suggesting, I'll think a little bit harder whether my comment has merit, but I doubt anyone else will hold themselves to such a standard. Who would want to? I wanna be free!!!

Fast and Bulbous
#214 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

Your right to be free shouldn’t infringe on other peoples’ rights to this blog, unless you’re offering to pay for the blog zoot?  Your rights have to be balanced out with other peoples’ rights.  See #174. 

krib
#215 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

well, see...that's the thing. It may be obvious to you, but not to me, because, as I've said, to me, Grimes is just as derivative as Zeus.

I'm not sure who has bad-mouthed Grimes. I haven't seen it, but I don't consider saying "I don't like" something to be bad-mouthing. It's taste, and everybody has different tastes

124th Street Beat
#216 posted by
124th Street Beat
on Mar 26, 2012

@CDNz1 and zoot alors and krib

Since i have to run soon I thought I would respond en masse. First- thanks for saying hi! But to clarify what I was trying to say-I have been here for a long time and have many meaningful discussions and fun times on the blog, and I really don't mind if I only get intermittent responses to my posts because I know I am on the edge of a very tightly knit community.  What i was trying to say is I can see how difficult it is at times for new bloggers to get involved when you haven't been around as long as I and have seen the blog evolve. It can be intimidating and a bit off putting- I know several people who have checked it out and feel like they are crashing some sort of party that they weren't invited to. I also really like reading posts from new people and sadly note that in more recent times not too many seem to stick around that much, and I think it might be because it does come off a little like a private club on the occasion. Just an observation. Doesn't mean I don't love it to death.

As for the haters comment- again, just from observations, there have been times in the past when someone has expressed some similar views to F&B's and have been pounced on quite furiously- some posters are a little more, ahem, forceful? than others in their responses- hence the "haters" comment- probably misused in this case. I should have used dismissive, which I think would have been more accurate.

Anyone, cheers everyone, I am on my way for a beer and burger before pulling a lovely all nighter- haven't don't that it quite some time!

124th Street Beat
#217 posted by
124th Street Beat
on Mar 26, 2012

Gads that post looks so much longer once posted!

zoot aloors
#218 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

What's the better Blog? The one with 800+ reactions, requests, trivia tidbits, riddles, opinions, and random bullshit, compared to a well-defined, but sterile conversation of 30 posts?

124th Street Beat
#219 posted by
124th Street Beat
on Mar 26, 2012

@zoot

I agree

zoot aloors
#220 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Good stuff, 124th St. Thanks so much for that.

UATB
#221 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

returning....

I would not want to be part of a regulated blog.

If people do not respond to my comments, it does not bother me... I said what I wanted to say and that's the important thing.

I think a general "Wild West" blog or two, specifically for socializing, might slow down the traffic on blogs with specific questions. However, the majority of the blogs on the entire CBC site are empty...like, dead.

So, as zoot says, what is the better blog?

krib
#222 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

haha, yes. True, some of us are :-)

I don't know what you do to fix that, though. Limiting the number of posts isn't going to do it

zoot aloors
#223 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Fast i hope you know that you're a fierce debater, and there's NO hard feelings on my end, I dig your conviction and abilty to defend.

krib
#224 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

I'm gonna run, too. Just turned on the audio and discovered Lisa's show ended quite a while ago!

krib
#225 posted by
krib
on Mar 26, 2012

well said, Zoot (at 217)

zoot aloors
#226 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Peace, kribby, thanks for hanging out, man lots of fun!

Fast and Bulbous
#227 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ zoot

In the early days of R3 there were a lot more people posting here.  I don’t recall there being many 800 post shows, but there were several hundred post shows with many more people contributing.  That kind of community was far more interesting, and had a much broader appeal, than this kind. 

Fast and Bulbous
#228 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@ zoot

It’s easy to press a point when you’re on high and solid ground.  ;)

Fast and Bulbous
#229 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

Gotta run!  See you all tomorrow! ;)

CDNz1
#230 posted by
CDNz1
on Mar 26, 2012

@F&B - I'm not sure your numbers are quite accurate, but we welcome you here. It's free and open and all about the music. Some related stuff comes up occasionally and we have fun with it.

zoot aloors
#231 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

@ UATB, I'll have to catch up on my reading, eh? I just know I've got something waiting for me!! I'll check out Lionel Ritchie, first, lol!

@ Fast, cheers, buddy. great talking!

UATB
#232 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

eh!

zoot aloors
#233 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Ay-O!

zoot aloors
#234 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

So, UATB did the Blog slow down enough for you to join in? I saw you jumped on for a bit earlier, but it was craziness!

UATB
#235 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Yeh... I'm old and slow, you know!

zoot aloors
#236 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Carry Me, from New Pornographer's guitarist Todd Fancey's first solo album. Todd played bass in Limblifter with New 'Nog drummer Kurt Dahle.

zoot aloors
#237 posted by
zoot aloors
on Mar 26, 2012

Not too slow to leave a sweet music link behind! I really liked the Johnny Rivers video in the Lennon thread, dude, good stuff!

UATB
#238 posted by
UATB
on Mar 26, 2012

Thanks... Johnny is a cool cat!

Fast and Bulbous
#239 posted by
Fast and Bulbous
on Mar 26, 2012

@CDNz1 #230

Oh, I’m quite sure they're accurate.  I may not have been posting back then but I was around.  And in case you’re fretting, we welcome you here too! 

display   Oldest First |  Newest First
COMMENTS ARE NOW CLOSED FOR THIS POST!
 Limited Play

Login required

Oops - you have to be logged in to add to My Saved Items.